Elon Musk showed interest in an idea that would guarantee a $5,000 payment, or 'DOGE Dividend,' to every American to show off the $55 billion in taxpayer funds saved.
Leaving aside how often theyve been proven by their own numbers to be lying about their totals, it’s not even complicated math that you’re getting bamboozled by.
Hell, you don’t even need to do the math, you could logic your way out of this pretty easily.
Did you pay $5000 in federal taxes minus FICA last year? Did you pay $25k?
What happened the last time these idiots turned on a money printer?
Will these “savings” be disbursed every year? You’re not getting the services that apparently cost 5x as much anymore.
Why not start a $25k yearly UBI if they aren’t lying about the savings? The science is incredibly clear, it’d pay for itself, make even more programs unnecessary, and end homelessness overnight. Not to mention kick the economy into overdrive.
What does Elon, crypto enthusiast, have to gain from another round of inflation? Or the owner class in general, whose wealth is tied into inflation-resistant property?
No, I won’t be burning the check in a pointless gesture of defiance.
I’ll be buying guns and ammo with it for the collapse.
I can’t believe I’m agreeing with you of all people, but I have as well and as strange as it may sound to people who haven’t, there is a certain proportion of the homeless population which is homeless by choice. It’s not a large proportion, but it’s not that small either.
It’s a chicken and egg problem with many schizophrenic and borderline homeless where you can’t tell if they ended up on the street due to mental illness or if living on the street made them mentally ill, but I have personally seen people choose to leave housing projects to go back to the street, and have heard similar stories from others.
That said, of course using this fact as an excuse to not do everything we can to house the majority of homeless who do want homes and to support the ones who don’t in other ways (soup kitchens, clinics, etc and mental health counseling for those who want it) is absurd.
Thank you. I’m glad there is finally someone else in this conversation that has also worked with the homeless.
I don’t know why people don’t think I’m sympathetic to homeless people–actually I do, they are just mad because I didn’t vote for Harris–but I am sympathetic. If I wasn’t, I wouldn’t have been able to work with them for so many years.
But it’s an addiction/mental illness problem, not an income problem for most homeless.
In fact, it’s very easy to look up too. So I don’t even understand why people here are arguing.
Now, money committed to the overall problem is needed, but UBI to people won’t actually solve the homeless situation for most of that population. Money for programs to help them, and stay with them, etc, WILL. But that’s not what what UBI is, and that is the point I was making.
And here’s the thing that Lemmy needs to know about this situation: Democrats have been in power plenty of times over the years. And the problem still hasn’t been solved. This isn’t a “Republicans caused this mess” problem. BOTH parties have fucked up on addressing this.
But I guess it’s easier for computer nerds who have never had to struggle in life just to say to say that I’m lying when I say I worked with the population for years. That’s easier than actually doing anything about it.
So Lemmy, step up. Dedicate your time and your money to helping the homeless. Then come back to this conversation and tell us what you learned.
Cuz I’m not taking Lemmy seriously. You guys have made $80K + a years since you were fucking 20. You all don’t know shit about the homeless population or what it’s like to work with them.
Not you, Peruvian Skies, I am talking about the other armchair critics in this thread.
No one is talking about the willing homeless as a problem, except for the fascists who are also gleefully dismantling the social aid networks for the mentally ill and addicted.
Yeah, we are. That’s what we are talking about in this sub conversation that started when someone said UBI would end the homeless problem overnight and i disagreed.
Have you worked with the homeless community? I worked directly with them for over 4 years. Community outreach shelter.
For the vast, vast majority in my area, money/income wasn’t the main cause of their homelessness. Even providing them with free shelter and housing didn’t work. 100 percent of all our cases, the person returned to the streets by choice within 6 months.
The rules for the free housing were: no illegal drugs, work with the back-to-work training program (in order to get them skills for having a job), and not tearing up the housing.
If you worked with homeless people, you can imagine how that worked out. Our homeless community just did NOT want to be anywhere that any any rules whatsoever, even rules as lax as those.
Monthly UBI wouldn’t go towards housing costs for our population of homeless people. Maybe your homeless community is different, but from working with several agencies nationwide, I heard many similar complaints to what I just laid out.
Now if you are talking about a single mom, with 2 kids, who just got laid off and can’t afford childcare, so she sleeps in her car, fuck yes, UBI would solve that. But that’s not the clientele that make up 99.9 percent of homeless communities.
Have you worked with homeless communities in a professional capacity?
Oh really? I’m full of shit? Ok, so what was your capacity with regards to working with the homeless community?
And why do so many people who work with homeless communities agree with me? Are they “full of shit” too?
I actually think you know I’m right, but since you think I worship Trump, you aren’t gonna agree with anything I say.
Even though I didn’t vote for him. But let me guess, you think I’m “full of shit” when I say that too, right? lol
You already have your mind made up about me. We’ve already had previous discussions. What do you hope to achieve by constantly saying stuff and then getting mad at my replies?
I have mentioned what I’ve done for a living since I joined Lemmy. In fact, the very reason I was able to retire at 54 is because I worked for the state. I have no fucking reason to lie to just win an argument with some random lemmy person who is mad that I didn’t vote for Harris.
But even ignoring your bias, I’d LOVE UBI. Fuck, if you wanna waste it on homeless people, go for it. As long as all of us get it, I don’t care how they waste theirs.
And yet, instead, you just settled for maybe the concept of a $5k one time payment while your taxes got raised, consumer and union protections got gutted and you still wagged your little tail and begged for more scraps.
Because it’s only 20% of the money they have saved from canceling programs. So it’s a big refund to us, that we’ve already paid the gvt.
But you are totally free to donate your 5K check if you don’t believe in it.
Leaving aside how often theyve been proven by their own numbers to be lying about their totals, it’s not even complicated math that you’re getting bamboozled by.
Hell, you don’t even need to do the math, you could logic your way out of this pretty easily.
Did you pay $5000 in federal taxes minus FICA last year? Did you pay $25k?
What happened the last time these idiots turned on a money printer?
Will these “savings” be disbursed every year? You’re not getting the services that apparently cost 5x as much anymore.
Why not start a $25k yearly UBI if they aren’t lying about the savings? The science is incredibly clear, it’d pay for itself, make even more programs unnecessary, and end homelessness overnight. Not to mention kick the economy into overdrive.
What does Elon, crypto enthusiast, have to gain from another round of inflation? Or the owner class in general, whose wealth is tied into inflation-resistant property?
No, I won’t be burning the check in a pointless gesture of defiance.
I’ll be buying guns and ammo with it for the collapse.
I’d be totally fine with that.
You’ve obviously never worked with the homeless community. Trust me, it would NOT end homelessness. lol
This dude has never worked with the homeless.
Are you referring to me or the other person. Because I did. For a little over 4 years in a paying position, and 3 years in a volunteering position.
Have you worked with them?
Totally lying lol
LMAO, you have no clue what you’re talking about.
You think I live in Russia, remember?! And that I’m a group of russians and spies. LMAO
weird neither do you. stop cosplaying my country men loser go fix your shit hole lol
What country do you think I’m in? You keep saying that, but you seem really afraid to say what your theories are. Come on, say it. lololol
I can’t believe I’m agreeing with you of all people, but I have as well and as strange as it may sound to people who haven’t, there is a certain proportion of the homeless population which is homeless by choice. It’s not a large proportion, but it’s not that small either.
It’s a chicken and egg problem with many schizophrenic and borderline homeless where you can’t tell if they ended up on the street due to mental illness or if living on the street made them mentally ill, but I have personally seen people choose to leave housing projects to go back to the street, and have heard similar stories from others.
That said, of course using this fact as an excuse to not do everything we can to house the majority of homeless who do want homes and to support the ones who don’t in other ways (soup kitchens, clinics, etc and mental health counseling for those who want it) is absurd.
Thank you. I’m glad there is finally someone else in this conversation that has also worked with the homeless.
I don’t know why people don’t think I’m sympathetic to homeless people–actually I do, they are just mad because I didn’t vote for Harris–but I am sympathetic. If I wasn’t, I wouldn’t have been able to work with them for so many years.
But it’s an addiction/mental illness problem, not an income problem for most homeless.
In fact, it’s very easy to look up too. So I don’t even understand why people here are arguing.
Now, money committed to the overall problem is needed, but UBI to people won’t actually solve the homeless situation for most of that population. Money for programs to help them, and stay with them, etc, WILL. But that’s not what what UBI is, and that is the point I was making.
And here’s the thing that Lemmy needs to know about this situation: Democrats have been in power plenty of times over the years. And the problem still hasn’t been solved. This isn’t a “Republicans caused this mess” problem. BOTH parties have fucked up on addressing this.
But I guess it’s easier for computer nerds who have never had to struggle in life just to say to say that I’m lying when I say I worked with the population for years. That’s easier than actually doing anything about it.
So Lemmy, step up. Dedicate your time and your money to helping the homeless. Then come back to this conversation and tell us what you learned.
Cuz I’m not taking Lemmy seriously. You guys have made $80K + a years since you were fucking 20. You all don’t know shit about the homeless population or what it’s like to work with them.
Not you, Peruvian Skies, I am talking about the other armchair critics in this thread.
No one is talking about the willing homeless as a problem, except for the fascists who are also gleefully dismantling the social aid networks for the mentally ill and addicted.
Yeah, we are. That’s what we are talking about in this sub conversation that started when someone said UBI would end the homeless problem overnight and i disagreed.
So near as to make no difference it absolutely would (at least if you do it in monthly payments… A yearly one would indeed be a bad idea)
Have you worked with the homeless community? I worked directly with them for over 4 years. Community outreach shelter.
For the vast, vast majority in my area, money/income wasn’t the main cause of their homelessness. Even providing them with free shelter and housing didn’t work. 100 percent of all our cases, the person returned to the streets by choice within 6 months.
The rules for the free housing were: no illegal drugs, work with the back-to-work training program (in order to get them skills for having a job), and not tearing up the housing.
If you worked with homeless people, you can imagine how that worked out. Our homeless community just did NOT want to be anywhere that any any rules whatsoever, even rules as lax as those.
Monthly UBI wouldn’t go towards housing costs for our population of homeless people. Maybe your homeless community is different, but from working with several agencies nationwide, I heard many similar complaints to what I just laid out.
Now if you are talking about a single mom, with 2 kids, who just got laid off and can’t afford childcare, so she sleeps in her car, fuck yes, UBI would solve that. But that’s not the clientele that make up 99.9 percent of homeless communities.
Have you worked with homeless communities in a professional capacity?
Yes, and you’re full of shit.
Oh really? I’m full of shit? Ok, so what was your capacity with regards to working with the homeless community?
And why do so many people who work with homeless communities agree with me? Are they “full of shit” too?
I actually think you know I’m right, but since you think I worship Trump, you aren’t gonna agree with anything I say.
Even though I didn’t vote for him. But let me guess, you think I’m “full of shit” when I say that too, right? lol
You already have your mind made up about me. We’ve already had previous discussions. What do you hope to achieve by constantly saying stuff and then getting mad at my replies?
I have mentioned what I’ve done for a living since I joined Lemmy. In fact, the very reason I was able to retire at 54 is because I worked for the state. I have no fucking reason to lie to just win an argument with some random lemmy person who is mad that I didn’t vote for Harris.
But even ignoring your bias, I’d LOVE UBI. Fuck, if you wanna waste it on homeless people, go for it. As long as all of us get it, I don’t care how they waste theirs.
💩💩💩💩💩
And yet, instead, you just settled for maybe the concept of a $5k one time payment while your taxes got raised, consumer and union protections got gutted and you still wagged your little tail and begged for more scraps.
So if you get a $5k payment, are you going to donate to the homeless? Totally your option to do that!